pcv freezing

[Exceptional62$]

i own a 2017 Equinox, less than 130000 miles on it. With no warning my car lost oil.. Now Im told it blew the real main seal, apon futher investigation of the engine timing chains, something froze causing all the damage to my car. Told that GM knows of this problem. Have been told GM has sent out how the car is to be drilled out to prevent this from happing again. I live in Michigan. We have freezing temps here. If these cars freeze causing damage, Why are they sold in Michigan. Total cost to fix 3300.00. Why???????

 

[ricklack]

It's not freezing, the PVC hole gets blocked by carbon etc. Temperature isn't an issue. What engine is in your 2017?

 

[Exceptional62$]

2.4l

 

[mrearly2]

Two years ago, the same thing occurred to my 2016 Equinox with the 2.4l four-banger. The PCV tube to the intake chamber froze because condensate can't drain from it, resulting in over-pressuring of the crankcase, which causes a blown rear main seal. It is a well-known issue with that engine. The most common remedy for that (of course after replacement of the RMS), is the installation of a vented oil fill cap, No. FC219.
As ricklack said, the orifice in the head becomes clogged with carbon. That's the root cause of the issue, isn't it? Carbon deposits, you know, are a "feature" of the wonderful GDI engines.

There are numerous posts on the Interwebz regarding this issue. Here's one: https://www.chevyequinoxforum.com/threads/rear-main-seal-blown.3156/#post-16808

And the vented oil fill cap doesn't always help...

Another: https://www.chevyequinoxforum.com/threads/rear-main-seal-blown.3156/#post-16808
and another: https://gmauthority.com/blog/topic/2017-equinox-lost-oil-and-blew-a-rear-main-seal/

 

[mrearly2]

I don't know how to make the links show up normally. Why don't they appear as regular text? Grrrr.

 

[pipwax]

Two years ago, the same thing occurred to my 2016 Equinox with the 2.4l four-banger. The PCV tube to the intake chamber froze because condensate can't drain from it, resulting in over-pressuring of the crankcase, which causes a blown rear main seal. It is a well-known issue with that engine. The most common remedy for that (of course after replacement of the RMS), is the installation of a vented oil fill cap, No. FC219.
As ricklack said, the orifice in the head becomes clogged with carbon. That's the root cause of the issue, isn't it? Carbon deposits, you know, are a "feature" of the wonderful GDI engines.

There are numerous posts on the Interwebz regarding this issue. Here's one: https://www.chevyequinoxforum.com/threads/rear-main-seal-blown.3156/#post-16808

And the vented oil fill cap doesn't always help...

Another: https://www.chevyequinoxforum.com/threads/rear-main-seal-blown.3156/#post-16808
and another: https://gmauthority.com/blog/topic/2017-equinox-lost-oil-and-blew-a-rear-main-seal/

yep, that's what I did. Replace the Oil cap with a vented cap.

 

[Tico007]

yep, that's what I did. Replace the Oil cap with a vented cap.

The vented cap can freeze as easy as the tube. It won’t save you.

 

[pipwax]

Ilive in Ga and my car is garage kept, so not a problem

 

[Tico007]

Ilive in Ga and my car is garage kept, so not a problem

Oh.. that cap is a Band-Aid for folks up north. It won’t do anything for you.

 

[Tico007]

Im up north in NH so I experience the same freezing problems you are having. You will read about catch cans hanging off the fresh air tube draining moisture. Pressure oil caps. None of that solves anything. The problem is still there. The engine is direct injected so there is no gas vapor wash for the intake ports, where the internal PCV orifice resides. So eventually the PCV orifice becomes blocked with carbon. The engine builds up with vapor/air pressure. With nowhere to go, the vapors reverse direction and exit out the fresh air tube. The hot vapor meets the cool air in the tube and you get moisture. Water. Up north ice. No good. The sad part is even if you clean the orifice you could still get moisture or ice because the tiny hole is just not efficient enough for all conditions. Venting through that cap is the equivalent of a vacuum leak and will eventually freeze shut as the hot vapors get stuck in the cap. I found that out the first week. See my picture.

The OEM orifice design is flawed. Your options are maintain the orifice removing the intake manifold to clean the holeonce a year. Drill a hole in the intake manifold so you can clean without taking it apart. Or what I do. Use an external PCV valve with a catch can under vacuum to remove pressure, fuel vapor, and moisture from the engine. Because it’s a PCV valve and not an orifice, air travels in one direction. Away from the fresh air tube. That’s just one of the problems solved by this set up.

 

[Tico007]

Something else I should mention. Oil consumption was reduced by at least 50% getting rid of the pressure. I can go 4500-5K and consume 1 quart. It was more than double that consumptionbefore the installation.

 

[HardNox_36]

Im up north in NH so I experience the same freezing problems you are having. You will read about catch cans hanging off the fresh air tube draining moisture. Pressure oil caps. None of that solves anything. The problem is still there. The engine is direct injected so there is no gas vapor wash for the intake ports, where the internal PCV orifice resides. So eventually the PCV orifice becomes blocked with carbon. The engine builds up with vapor/air pressure. With nowhere to go, the vapors reverse direction and exit out the fresh air tube. The hot vapor meets the cool air in the tube and you get moisture. Water. Up north ice. No good. The sad part is even if you clean the orifice you could still get moisture or ice because the tiny hole is just not efficient enough for all conditions. Venting through that cap is the equivalent of a vacuum leak and will eventually freeze shut as the hot vapors get stuck in the cap. I found that out the first week. See my picture.

The OEM orifice design is flawed. Your options are maintain the orifice removing the intake manifold to clean the holeonce a year. Drill a hole in the intake manifold so you can clean without taking it apart. Or what I do. Use an external PCV valve with a catch can under vacuum to remove pressure, fuel vapor, and moisture from the engine. Because it’s a PCV valve and not an orifice, air travels in one direction. Away from the fresh air tube. That’s just one of the problems solved by this set up.

What oil cap, pcv valve and E.E. catch can did you use? Going to do the same to ours. Great post.

 

[Tico007]

What oil cap, pcv valve and E.E. catch can did you use? Going to do the same to ours. Great post.

Document I wrote explaining. Any questions just ask

GM 2.4 PCV Valve Mod

Overview This document explains what the GM 2.4 Ecotec PCV valve mod does, why to use it, what parts are needed, and how to install it. This mod adds a PCV valve under vacuum to resolve or improve several issues with the GM 2.4 Ecotec engine including the buildup of moisture in the fresh air in...

docs.google.com

 

[HardNox_36]

Document I wrote explaining. Any questions just ask

GM 2.4 PCV Valve Mod

Overview This document explains what the GM 2.4 Ecotec PCV valve mod does, why to use it, what parts are needed, and how to install it. This mod adds a PCV valve under vacuum to resolve or improve several issues with the GM 2.4 Ecotec engine including the buildup of moisture in the fresh air in...

docs.google.com

Perfect. Thank you!

 

[Scrim_Ster]

Hi, @ Tico007 or everyone who has completed the adding of the external PCV valve to the 2.4 liter engine. I was wondering how your Equinox is doing since adding the external PCV valve to an oil fill cap with an inline oil catch can? Few questions if you don't mind. #1. Have you had a drop in MPG, #2. Any problems with fuel trim readings since the PCV controlled vacuum leak is a little bit more with the Acura PCV valve than with the tiny hole in the intake manifold, #3. Any check engine light because of it, #4. Any drivability problems since your mods? #5. Also, how much oil consumption do you have now between oil changes and how much of that oil loss ends up in your oil catch can? Overall how is it doing now compared to before your mods? Thank You for your help.

 

[Tico007]

hello, I don’t mind answering that. This is the third year and 40K.
1) MPG did not change.
2) Fuel trim is nearly even. Fluctuates between +2 and -2 depending on conditions. It’s not a vacuum leak because there is no venting. The output of the PCV valve routes back to the intake through the brake booster line. Nothing is going by the O2 sensor. Why the fuel trim is normal.
3) no check engine light because there is no vacuum leaks, fuel trim is almost perfect.
4) Driving and engine performance is a little bit better in my opinion because the engine is breathing better.
5) oil consumption has decreased. Maybe cut in half. I started using Valvoline restore and protect. That should help free up the rings. The catch can hardly fills up at all in the summer. In the winter, it’s more than half full. Moisture mostly. Some blow by because it’s direct injected.

 

[newsithlord]

Does this eliminate the requirement to clean the existing PCV opening in the intake manifold? Any reason why you couldn't/wouldn't cap the connection on the fresh air side of the throttle body?

Thanks!

 

[Tico007]

The internal orifice is no longer needed so you can leave it blocked. Adding the external PCV valve replaces it. Now you have a dirty side to install a catch can. You still need the clean side pcv tube to provide fresh air. It will stay clean after the PCV valve is installed.

 

[newsithlord]

You're going have to explain the fresh air thing to me. The PCV tube comes from the crankcase not outside air like the intake through the air filter. Although yes, it is mixing with fresh air, it is not truly fresh air. The only difference between it and the new PCV line is it enters the air stream before the throttle body as compared to after the throttle body (clean side/dirty side). Both are coming from a connection to the valve cover.

I would rather not have this air from the crank case hitting the throttle body just in case there was a small amount oil in it.

I'm probably way off, that's why I asked the question and I always want to learn. Thanks, for your help. I look forward to your explanation.

 

[Tico007]

Think about how EFI works. Metered air passes over the mass airflow sensor, through combustion, out the exhaust by the O2 sensor. Bypass that loop, bring in air outside of that, you will have problems with your fuel trim. The equivalent of a vacuum leak. Why that tube is where it is. What you’re describing is a bigger problem with an orifice. It’s just a hole with no check valve. So depending on conditions, the flow could reverse and go out that tube. Which is exactly what’s happening when the internal orifice is blocked. Another thing a PCV valve resolves. Or more accuratelyresolves 95%. There could still be a tiny bit of blow by that slips back out through that tube as you shut the engine off removing vacuum. Which is totally normal actually. All modern vehicles suffer from this why the throttle body and Maf gets dirty eventually.